Lost - Season 6 [Final]

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22 June 2006
34,856
NEO HRAKLEIO
Re: Lost - season 6 (final)

Mαλλον προσπαθουμε να δωσουμε απαντησεις, σε ερωτηματα που απλα δεν εχουν απαντησεις !
Enjoy the journey ....

Μην ξεχνατε , οτι και η συγχρονη φυσικη ειναι στην ουσια μεταφυσικη .
 

Johnson

AVClub Enthusiast
12 March 2009
913
Mainly:Andalucia/Europe
Re: Lost - season 6 (final)

ΤΕΛΟΣ! Τέρμα,αυτό ήταν.

Πολύ δράμα και γενικά όχι το τέλος που περίμενα αλλά για να πω και την αλήθεια.... Δεν ξέρω αν ήταν το τέλος που περίμενα γιατι δεν κατάλαβα ΤΙΠΟΤΑ!!!!!!!!

Αυτό που με μπέρδεψε πολύ ήταν που τους έδειχνε
στον άλλον κόσμο σαν να μην είχε πέσει ποτέ το αεροπλάνο.
Τώρα γιατί τους έδειχνε ποτέ δεν κατάλαβα ή απλά δεν πρόσεξα ή μπορεί επίσης να μου έλειπε κάτι απ'την προηγούμενη Season.Δηλαδή κάτσε,αν ήταν όλα στο μυαλό του Jack όταν πέρναγε στην άλλη μεριά,η ιστορία στο νησί τι ήταν?

Πάντως αν όλη η ιστορία ήταν
φαντασία του Jack....

ΔΕΝ ΤΟ ΔΕΧΟΜΑΙ!!!! ΟΧΙ!!!

Η ιστορία για μένα πάντως καταστράφηκε μετά την καταπακτή.

Περίμενα το μυστήριο να μείνει μυστήριο και να υπήρχε μια ατμόσφαιρα πως να το πω,ατμόσφαιρα "Dharma",δηλαδή μια αίσθηση και ατμόσφαιρα παρατημένου πειράματος των 70's απ'το οποίο είχαν μείνει κάποιοι στο νησί,και μπλα μπλα 3 Season ιστορία με το πείραμα να εμπλέκεται στην ιστορία,λίγο απόπειρες να φύγουν απ'το νησί,περισσότερες ανακαλύψεις παρατημένων σταθμων στο νησί,λίγη αγωνία όπως τότε με το πλοίο που χε πλησιάσει,μέχρι που στο τέλος φεύγουν όλοι απ'το νησί με κάποιον τρόπο,όμορφα και ωραία και πάνω απ'όλα ΕΦΙΚΤΑ χωρίς Paranormal ιστορίες.

Επομένως ούτε ιάκωβος,ούτε προπαραγγελίες ατόμων στο νησί,ούτε τίποτα.

Ήταν η καλύτερη σειρά,αλλά από την μέση μέχρι το τέλος ήταν πολύ ψυχοπλακωτική.

Απ'την μια θα ήθελα να την ξαναδώ,αλλά απ'την άλλη δεν ξαναβασανίζομαι έτσι... ποτέ...
 

Sotiris

Supreme Member
18 June 2006
4,049
Απάντηση: Lost - season 6 (final)

Εσείς τελικά πως το λάβατε;
Ότι όταν έπεσε το αεροπλάνο σκοτώθηκαν όλοι και μείναμε στην φαντασία του Τζακ;
Ή συνέβησαν όλα τα γεγονότα στο νησί κανονικά και η μόνη φαντασία ήταν το flash back, ο παράλληλος χρόνος, πείτε το όπως θέλετε που βλέπαμε στην season 6;
 

Kosh

Μέλος Σωματείου
7 September 2006
91,638
Εκεί ψηλά.....
Re: Lost - season 6 (final)

Η ιστορία για μένα πάντως καταστράφηκε μετά την καταπακτή.

Περίμενα το μυστήριο να μείνει μυστήριο και να υπήρχε μια ατμόσφαιρα πως να το πω,ατμόσφαιρα "Dharma",δηλαδή μια αίσθηση και ατμόσφαιρα παρατημένου πειράματος των 70's απ'το οποίο είχαν μείνει κάποιοι στο νησί,και μπλα μπλα 3 Season ιστορία με το πείραμα να εμπλέκεται στην ιστορία,λίγο απόπειρες να φύγουν απ'το νησί,περισσότερες ανακαλύψεις παρατημένων σταθμων στο νησί,λίγη αγωνία όπως τότε με το πλοίο που χε πλησιάσει,μέχρι που στο τέλος φεύγουν όλοι απ'το νησί με κάποιον τρόπο,όμορφα και ωραία και πάνω απ'όλα ΕΦΙΚΤΑ χωρίς Paranormal ιστορίες.



+1

Συμφωνουμε απολυτα.

Η αδρεναλινη που κυκλοφορησε οταν ανοιξε η καταπακτη και αργοτερα με το κουμπακι και τον υπολοιπο σταθμο της dharma δεν ξαναηρθε ποτε.


Μετα το μαμησανε και ψοφησε....
 

Kosh

Μέλος Σωματείου
7 September 2006
91,638
Εκεί ψηλά.....
Re: Απάντηση: Lost - season 6 (final)

Εσείς τελικά πως το λάβατε;

Ή συνέβησαν όλα τα γεγονότα στο νησί κανονικά και η μόνη φαντασία ήταν το flash back, ο παράλληλος χρόνος, πείτε το όπως θέλετε που βλέπαμε στην season 6;

Αυτο.



Λαβαμε βεβαια και οτι μαλλον υπερεκτιμησαμε το ταλεντο των σεναριογραφων.....


Θυμαται κανεις ποτε αλλαξαν οι σεναριογραφοι? Απο την ιδια ομαδα παραγωγης θυμαμαι οτι προσληφθηκαν οι σεναριογραφοι του Alias οταν αυτο τελειωσε μιας και ηταν δικη τους παραγωγη και αποχωρησαν οι αρχικοι....
 
22 June 2006
34,856
NEO HRAKLEIO
Re: Lost - season 6 (final)

Tα σημαντικοτερα απαντηθηκαν απο τον πατερα του Jake... "Ολα ηταν αληθινα " ειπε, η πτωση του αεροπλανου, οι σχεσεις που αναπτηχθηκαν , η επιστροφη στο νησι, και αργοτερα ο θανατος πολλων (σε ΔΙΑΦΟΡΕΤΙΚΟΥΣ χρονοιυς) και τελος η επανενωση για τη "μετα θανατου συνεχεια"...

Οπως ειπε επισης ¨Ολοι καποτε πεθαινουν" , απλα οχι την ιδια στιγμη, ο χρονος δεν εχει σημασια πριν και μετα τον θανατο !.

Ολοι ειχαν μια δευτερη ευκαιρια , μετα τη πτωση, και ηταν στο χερι τους πως να την αξιοποιησουν , μετα τη μιζερη και ανουσια προηγουμενη ζωη τους.
 

jim...

Moderator
Staff member
22 February 2008
24,622
Μπακοτσιάνος...
Re: Lost - season 6 (final)

Προφανώς γιαυτό είχε τέτοιο τέλος.

Ακριβώς γιαυτό που κάνουμε τώρα...







:ernaehrung004::ernaehrung004:

respect από μένα στους σεναριογράφους..................
 

Johnson

AVClub Enthusiast
12 March 2009
913
Mainly:Andalucia/Europe
Re: Lost - season 6 (final)

Να μια ενδιαφέρουσα συζήτηση που είχα στο Youtube,την βάζω σε Quote Tag και ίσως περιέχει Spoilers για μερικούς:

i'll give you the scientific answer: ever heard about the string-theory? that's what happend through the 6 seasons of LOST. each of the seasons represents 1 dimension. of course we could say that the first 3 represent the 3rd dimension, while the 4th represents the 4th dimension (= time) and so on. 5th = "stabilized" time traveling (some are in the present, some in the past). 6th = parallel universe/parallel time-line.

the finale has in fact two separate endings. don't forget that the producers are big fans of stephen king and stephen king is a fan of LOST. so it doesn't surprise that they've made a 2-endings-finale like stephen king did in the dark tower series!

season 6 is the 6th dimension. two different dimensions with two different stories and two different endings running at the same time. in one dimension only ben and hurley are alive, because they are the new jacobs. in the other dimension we have more who're alive: hurley, ben, kate, sawyer, miles and the pilot

Me: Yeah but the problem is that in the second ending all the characters are dead so this ending/world can be possible only if the characters died in the island,but in fact hurley and ben didn't died,and we also didn't seen the plane crashing,but we did seen hurley,ben,etc,in the other ending so they were together with the dead people.

Αυτό που γράφει είναι μια θεωρία και μπορώ να πω έξυπνη.
Αυτό που έγραψα βέβαια δεν στέκει αν έβαλαν ζωντανούς - νεκρούς μαζί για παρέα. :flipout:

Αν πάντως έγινε έτσι,θέλαμε να δούμε Lost όχι Stephen King. :flipout:

http://www.youtube.com/comment_servlet?all_comments&v=PBeJU1lpcWk
 

AlexTheodin

Supreme Member
25 December 2007
5,912
Athens, Thessaloniki, Köln
Re: Lost - season 6 (final)

Έτσι με έκανε να νιώσω ο AlexTheodin στα προηγούμενα post.-bye-

Με συγχωρείς, δεν ήταν ο σκοπός μου. Αν σε προσέβαλα με οποιονδήποτε τρόπο, έγινε άθελα μου και ζητω συγνώμη. Την άποψη μου ήθελα να γράψω και μερικά σημεία που ίσως απο τους μη προσεκτικούς θεατές να ξεφύγαν.

Ένα σημείο ας πούμε που βλέπω μπέρδεψε μερικούς φίλους.

Δεν ήταν νεκροί απο την πρώτη σεζόν. Η "εναλλακτική πραγματικότητα" στην οποία συναντήθηκαν οι ψυχές είναι ανεξάρτητη απο τον βασικό κορμό και αναφέρεται στο πού πήγαν όταν όλοι αυτοί πεθάναν. Δεν υπάρχει σε μια συγκεκριμένη χρονική στιγμή προφανώς αφού δεν αποτελεί μέρος του υλικού κόσμου. Είναι μια θεωρεία/άποψη για το "μετά" στο οποίο περιμένουν ο ένας τον άλλο. Αυτό είναι το δικό τους, δεν σημαίνει οτι δεν έχουν άλλα αντίστοιχα οι υπόλοιποι χαρακτήρες. Ο Tom με τον γκόμενο του πχ κλπ...
Γιαυτό και η ατάκα της Kate στον Jack, οτι μου έλλειψες. Στην υπόλοιπη της ζωή αφού ξεφυγε απο το νησί και μέχρι να πεθάνει και η ίδια, εννοούσε.

Στο LostPedia στο κανονικό κομμάτι και όχι στο φόρουμ των θεωρειών αναφέρονται μόνο όσα έχουν δείξει στην σειρά, έχουν αποκαλύψει οι δημιουργοί στα podcasts και έχουν αποκαλυφθεί στα διάφορα συνοδά μέσα (το Lost Experience, mobisodes, Dharma Orientation videos, κλπ). Όλα αυτά είναι μέρος της σειράς για όσους αρέσκονται στα παζλ και εξηγούν αρκετά...
 
22 June 2006
34,856
NEO HRAKLEIO
Re: Lost - season 6 (final)

Για οσους δεν καταλαβαν αρκετα ή απογοητευτηκαν με το τελος, εδω ισω δινεται η πιο ολοκληρωμενη εξηγηση για τι τι εγινε , σε γενικες γραμμες στο LOST !

http://lostmediamentions.blogspot.com/2010/05/someone-from-bad-robots-take-on-finale.html

"Good stuff on here! I can finally throw in my two cents! I've had to bite my tongue for far too long. Also, hopefully I can answer some of John's questions about Dharma and the "pointless breadcrumbs" that really, weren't so pointless ...

First ...
The Island:

It was real. Everything that happened on the island that we saw throughout the 6 seasons was real. Forget the final image of the plane crash, it was put in purposely to f*&k with people's heads and show how far the show had come. They really crashed. They really survived. They really discovered Dharma and the Others. The Island keeps the balance of good and evil in the world. It always has and always will perform that role. And the Island will always need a "Protector". Jacob wasn't the first, Hurley won't be the last. However, Jacob had to deal with a malevolent force (MIB) that his mother, nor Hurley had to deal with. He created the devil and had to find a way to kill him -- even though the rules prevented him from actually doing so.

Thus began Jacob's plan to bring candidates to the Island to do the one thing he couldn't do. Kill the MIB. He had a huge list of candidates that spanned generations. Yet everytime he brought people there, the MIB corrupted them and caused them to kill one another. That was until Richard came along and helped Jacob understand that if he didn't take a more active role, then his plan would never work.

Enter Dharma -- which I'm not sure why John is having such a hard time grasping. Dharma, like the countless scores of people that were brought to the island before, were brought there by Jacob as part of his plan to kill the MIB. However, the MIB was aware of this plan and interferred by "corrupting" Ben. Making Ben believe he was doing the work of Jacob when in reality he was doing the work of the MIB. This carried over into all of Ben's "off-island" activities. He was the leader. He spoke for Jacob as far as they were concerned. So the "Others" killed Dharma and later were actively trying to kill Jack, Kate, Sawyer, Hurley and all the candidates because that's what the MIB wanted. And what he couldn't do for himself.

Dharma was originally brought in to be good. But was turned bad by MIB's corruption and eventually destroyed by his pawn Ben. Now, was Dharma only brought there to help Jack and the other Canditates on their overall quest to kill Smokey? Or did Jacob have another list of Canidates from the Dharma group that we were never aware of? That's a question that is purposley not answered because whatever answer the writers came up with would be worse than the one you come up with for yourself. Still ... Dharma's purpose is not "pointless" or even vague. Hell, it's pretty blantent.

Still, despite his grand plan, Jacob wanted to give his "candidates" (our Lostaways) the one thing he, nor his brother, were ever afforded: free will. Hence him bringing a host of "candidates" through the decades and letting them "choose" which one would actually do the job in the end. Maybe he knew Jack would be the one to kill Flocke and that Hurley would be the protector in the end. Maybe he didn't. But that was always the key question of the show: Fate vs Free-will. Science vs Faith. Personally I think Jacob knew from the beginning what was going to happen and that everyone played a part over 6 seasons in helping Jack get to the point where he needed to be to kill Smokey and make Hurley the protector -- I know that's how a lot of the writers viewed it. But again, they won't answer that (nor should they) because that ruins the fun.

In the end, Jack got to do what he always wanted to do from the very first episode of the show: Save his fellow Lostaways. He got Kate and Sawyer off the island and he gave Hurley the purpose in life he'd always been missing. And, in Sideways world (which we'll get to next) he in fact saved everyone by helping them all move on ...

Now...

Sideways World:

Sideways world is where it gets really cool in terms of theology and metaphysical discussion (for me at least -- because I love history/religion theories and loved all the talks in the writer's room about it). Basically what the show is proposing is that we're all linked to certain people during our lives. Call them soulmates (though it's not exactly the best word). But these people we're linked to are with us duing "the most important moments of our lives" as Christian said. These are the people we move through the universe with from lifetime to lifetime. It's loosely based in Hinduisim with large doses of western religion thrown into the mix.

The conceit that the writers created, basing it off these religious philosophies, was that as a group, the Lostaways subconsciously created this "sideways" world where they exist in purgatory until they are "awakened" and find one another. Once they all find one another, they can then move on and move forward. In essence, this is the show's concept of the afterlife. According to the show, everyone creates their own "Sideways" purgatory with their "soulmates" throughout their lives and exist there until they all move on together. That's a beautiful notion. Even if you aren't religious or even spirtual, the idea that we live AND die together is deeply profound and moving.

It's a really cool and spirtual concept that fits the whole tone and subtext the show has had from the beginning. These people were SUPPOSED to be together on that plane. They were supposed to live through these events -- not JUST because of Jacob. But because that's what the universe or God (depending on how religious you wish to get) wanted to happen. The show was always about science vs faith -- and it ultimately came down on the side of faith. It answered THE core question of the series. The one question that has been at the root of every island mystery, every character backstory, every plot twist. That, by itself, is quite an accomplishment.

How much you want to extrapolate from that is up to you as the viewer. Think about season 1 when we first found the Hatch. Everyone thought that's THE answer! Whatever is down there is the answer! Then, as we discovered it was just one station of many. One link in a very long chain that kept revealing more, and more of a larger mosiac.

But the writer's took it even further this season by contrasting this Sideways "purgatory" with the Island itself. Remember when Michael appeared to Hurley, he said he was not allowed to leave the Island. Just like the MIB. He wasn't allowed into this sideways world and thus, was not afforded the opportunity to move on. Why? Because he had proven himself to be unworthy with his actions on the Island. He failed the test. The others, passed. They made it into Sideways world when they died -- some before Jack, some years later. In Hurley's case, maybe centuries later. They exist in this sideways world until they are "awakened" and they can only move on TOGETHER because they are linked. They are destined to be together for eternity. That was their destiny.

They were NOT linked to Anna Lucia, Daniel, Roussou, Alex, Miles, Lupidis, (and all the rest who weren't in the chuch -- basically everyone who wasn't in season 1). Yet those people exist in Sideways world. Why? Well again, here's where they leave it up to you to decide. The way I like to think about it, is that those people who were left behind in Sideways world have to find their own soulmates before they can wake up. It's possible that those links aren't people from the island but from their other life (Anna's parnter, the guy she shot --- Roussou's husband, etc etc).

A lot of people have been talking about Ben and why he didn't go into the Church. And if you think of Sideways world in this way, then it gives you the answer to that very question. Ben can't move on yet because he hasn't connected with the people he needs to. It's going to be his job to awaken Roussou, Alex, Anna Lucia (maybe), Ethan, Goodspeed, his father and the rest. He has to attone for his sins more than he did by being Hurley's number two. He has to do what Hurley and Desmond did for our Lostaways with his own people. He has to help them connect. And he can only move on when all the links in his chain are ready to. Same can be said for Faraday, Charlotte, Whidmore, Hawkins etc. It's really a neat, and cool concept. At least to me.

But, from a more "behind the scenes" note: the reason Ben's not in the church, and the reason no one is in the church but for Season 1 people is because they wrote the ending to the show after writing the pilot. And never changed it. The writers always said (and many didn't believe them) that they knew their ending from the very first episode. I applaud them for that. It's pretty fantastic. Originally Ben was supposed to have a 3 episode arc and be done. But he became a big part of the show. They could have easily changed their ending and put him in the church -- but instead they problem solved it. Gave him a BRILLIANT moment with Locke outside the church ... and then that was it. I loved that. For those that wonder -- the original ending started the moment Jack walked into the church and touches the casket to Jack closing his eyes as the other plane flies away. That was always JJ's ending. And they kept it.

For me the ending of this show means a lot. Not only because I worked on it, but because as a writer it inspired me in a way the medium had never done before. I've been inspired to write by great films. Maybe too many to count. And there have been amazing TV shows that I've loved (X-Files, 24, Sopranos, countless 1/2 hour shows). But none did what LOST did for me. None showed me that you could take huge risks (writing a show about faith for network TV) and stick to your creative guns and STILL please the audience. I learned a lot from the show as a writer. I learned even more from being around the incredible writers, producers, PAs, interns and everyone else who slaved on the show for 6 years.

In the end, for me, LOST was a touchstone show that dealt with faith, the afterlife, and all these big, spirtual questions that most shows don't touch. And to me, they never once waivered from their core story -- even with all the sci-fi elements they mixed in. To walk that long and daunting of a creative tightrope and survive is simply astounding."
 

AlexTheodin

Supreme Member
25 December 2007
5,912
Athens, Thessaloniki, Köln
Re: Απάντηση: Lost - season 6 (final)

Λαβαμε βεβαια και οτι μαλλον υπερεκτιμησαμε το ταλεντο των σεναριογραφων.....

Δεν νομίζω βρε Ναθ. Ο σεναριογράφος φαίνεται στο αν μπορεί να εξηγήσει επιστημονικά θεωρείες που ακόμα και για θεωρητικούς φυσικού ανήκουν στην σφαίρα της φαντασίας? Ή στο κατα πόσο μπορεί να δημιουργήσει πραγματικούς χαρακτήρες που αγαπούν, συγκρούονται και μας παρασύρουν με τις περιπέτειές του?

Σκέψου τα καινούργια Star Wars. Όλα εξηγούνται με τρόπο (για το κόσμο αυτό πάντα) πειστικά. Όμως οι χαρακτήρες και η πορεία τους είναι τελείως σχηματικοί και χάρτινοι. Δεν σε πείθουν...

Συμφωνώ μαζί σου οτι δεν δώσαν στο τέλος μια ολοκληρωμένη επιστημονική εξήγηση για το τί ειναι το νησί, το φως, ο ΜΙΒ και όλα. Επέλεξαν να τα δείξουν όλα απο την πλευρά των χαρακτήρων, που δεν ξέρουν τι συμβαίνει, παρα μόνο να σωθούν και να σώσουν τους υπόλοιπους. Για αυτούς δεν θα πρόσθετε τίποτα να μάθουν αν το φως είναι ακτινοβολία ή ο Θεός...

Άσε που δεν νομίζω οτι υπήρχε μια και μόνη θεωρία που να εξηγεί τα πάντα μέχρι την τελευταία λεπτομέρεια, και αν υπήρχε αυτή θα έπρεπε να παρουσιαστεί σε μορφή λιστας (ή εγκυκλοπαίδειας...:2thumb22sup:).
 

Kosh

Μέλος Σωματείου
7 September 2006
91,638
Εκεί ψηλά.....
Re: Απάντηση: Lost - season 6 (final)

Δεν νομίζω βρε Ναθ. Ο σεναριογράφος φαίνεται στο αν μπορεί να εξηγήσει επιστημονικά θεωρείες που ακόμα και για θεωρητικούς φυσικού ανήκουν στην σφαίρα της φαντασίας? Ή στο κατα πόσο μπορεί να δημιουργήσει πραγματικούς χαρακτήρες που αγαπούν, συγκρούονται και μας παρασύρουν με τις περιπέτειές του?

Ο σεναριογραφος εκτος απο τους χαρακτηρες στους οποιους ειχε ριξει πολυ μεγαλο βαρος απο την πρωτη κι ολας σαιζον (θυμομαστε οτι καθε επεισοδιο ηταν βασισμενο σε εναν χαρακτηρα καθε φορα) θα επρεπε αν οχι να απαντησει σε καποια πραγματα να σεβαστει μια κοινοτητα .


Μια κοινοτητα που ξημεροβραδυαζοταν οχι για να βιωσει τον ερωτα του Τζακ με την Κεητ αλλα για να δει τι στα διαλα ηταν ο τροχος που γυριζε τον χρονο, πως εξαφανιζοταν ενα ολοκληρο νησι και πολυ βασικα ερωτηματα.


Ειναι σαν να τελειωνε ο Πολεμος των Αστρων χωρις καμια μονομαχια με φωτοσπαθα και στον αντιποδα να βλεπαμε τον ερωτα και πως αυτος επηρεαζει την "δυναμη" .

Ε θα επεφταν οι τοματες ή δεν θα επεφταν ?


Και ξαναλεω.....η σειρα αλλαξε ροτα απο τον πρωτο κυκλο και μετα για ενα λογο :


Επειδη πηραν πολυ στα σοβαρα τις δημοσκοπησεις των φανς που αρχισαν να δημιουργουν ενα τεραστιο συστημα ερωτηματων και φαντασιωσεων οχι για το ποιος θα τα φτιαξει με ποιον αλλα για τα επιστημονικα δεδομενα και μυστηρια του νησιου.

Οποτε δεν μπορεις να τους φτυνεις και να τους προδιδεις ετσι στα ισα επειδη το παρακανες και το ξεχειλωσες οσο δεν επαιρνε για να κονομησεις απο 3 σαιζον ακομα με κυριο αξονα τα προσωπα.....και το ανθρωποκεντρικο στοιχειο της σειρας...
 

mamra

New member
20 January 2010
34
Re: Lost - season 6 (final)

Θα χρησιμοποιήσω μια μόνο λέξη, δεν αξίζει παραπάνω, για το φινάλε. Αστείο.

Ανήκω στην ομάδα ατόμων που σταμάτησε να ασχολείται, ψάχνει, γράφει γι' αυτή τη σειρά αρκετό καιρό τώρα, την έβλεπα για να δω που θα το πάει. Τελικά έγινε αυτό που περίμενα (φοβόμουν), δεν πήγε πουθενά.

Δεν τελειώνουν έτσι οι μεγάλες σειρές. Όλες έχουν ψεγάδια, άλλα όχι τόσες χοντράδες. Μιλάω πάντα για σειρές μυστηρίου/Ε.Φ.. Προσωπική άποψη πάντα.
 
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22 June 2006
34,856
NEO HRAKLEIO
Re: Lost - season 6 (final)

Απο την αρχη το Lost εδειχνε οτι νοιαζεται κυριως για τους χαρακτηρες και τις ιστοριες τους ... κριμα που αρκετοι δεν το καταλαβαν.

Πως δηλ. περιμενετε να εξηγησουν κατι που ακομη και η συγχρονη φυσικη αδυνατει να εξηγησει (αν και υπαρχει η θεωρια που τα προβλεπει - οπως ταξιδια στο χρονο, παραλληλα συμπαντα, θεωρια χορδων κλπ)...
 

Tek_Killa

AVClub Enthusiast
5 February 2008
1,028
Re: Lost - season 6 (final)

Για οσους δεν καταλαβαν αρκετα ή απογοητευτηκαν με το τελος, εδω ισω δινεται η πιο ολοκληρωμενη εξηγηση για τι τι εγινε , σε γενικες γραμμες στο LOST !

http://lostmediamentions.blogspot.com/2010/05/someone-from-bad-robots-take-on-finale.html

"Good stuff on here! I can finally throw in my two cents! I've had to bite my tongue for far too long. Also, hopefully I can answer some of John's questions about Dharma and the "pointless breadcrumbs" that really, weren't so pointless ...

First ...
The Island:

It was real. Everything that happened on the island that we saw throughout the 6 seasons was real. Forget the final image of the plane crash, it was put in purposely to f*&k with people's heads and show how far the show had come. They really crashed. They really survived. They really discovered Dharma and the Others. The Island keeps the balance of good and evil in the world. It always has and always will perform that role. And the Island will always need a "Protector". Jacob wasn't the first, Hurley won't be the last. However, Jacob had to deal with a malevolent force (MIB) that his mother, nor Hurley had to deal with. He created the devil and had to find a way to kill him -- even though the rules prevented him from actually doing so.

Thus began Jacob's plan to bring candidates to the Island to do the one thing he couldn't do. Kill the MIB. He had a huge list of candidates that spanned generations. Yet everytime he brought people there, the MIB corrupted them and caused them to kill one another. That was until Richard came along and helped Jacob understand that if he didn't take a more active role, then his plan would never work.

Enter Dharma -- which I'm not sure why John is having such a hard time grasping. Dharma, like the countless scores of people that were brought to the island before, were brought there by Jacob as part of his plan to kill the MIB. However, the MIB was aware of this plan and interferred by "corrupting" Ben. Making Ben believe he was doing the work of Jacob when in reality he was doing the work of the MIB. This carried over into all of Ben's "off-island" activities. He was the leader. He spoke for Jacob as far as they were concerned. So the "Others" killed Dharma and later were actively trying to kill Jack, Kate, Sawyer, Hurley and all the candidates because that's what the MIB wanted. And what he couldn't do for himself.

Dharma was originally brought in to be good. But was turned bad by MIB's corruption and eventually destroyed by his pawn Ben. Now, was Dharma only brought there to help Jack and the other Canditates on their overall quest to kill Smokey? Or did Jacob have another list of Canidates from the Dharma group that we were never aware of? That's a question that is purposley not answered because whatever answer the writers came up with would be worse than the one you come up with for yourself. Still ... Dharma's purpose is not "pointless" or even vague. Hell, it's pretty blantent.

Still, despite his grand plan, Jacob wanted to give his "candidates" (our Lostaways) the one thing he, nor his brother, were ever afforded: free will. Hence him bringing a host of "candidates" through the decades and letting them "choose" which one would actually do the job in the end. Maybe he knew Jack would be the one to kill Flocke and that Hurley would be the protector in the end. Maybe he didn't. But that was always the key question of the show: Fate vs Free-will. Science vs Faith. Personally I think Jacob knew from the beginning what was going to happen and that everyone played a part over 6 seasons in helping Jack get to the point where he needed to be to kill Smokey and make Hurley the protector -- I know that's how a lot of the writers viewed it. But again, they won't answer that (nor should they) because that ruins the fun.

In the end, Jack got to do what he always wanted to do from the very first episode of the show: Save his fellow Lostaways. He got Kate and Sawyer off the island and he gave Hurley the purpose in life he'd always been missing. And, in Sideways world (which we'll get to next) he in fact saved everyone by helping them all move on ...

Now...

Sideways World:

Sideways world is where it gets really cool in terms of theology and metaphysical discussion (for me at least -- because I love history/religion theories and loved all the talks in the writer's room about it). Basically what the show is proposing is that we're all linked to certain people during our lives. Call them soulmates (though it's not exactly the best word). But these people we're linked to are with us duing "the most important moments of our lives" as Christian said. These are the people we move through the universe with from lifetime to lifetime. It's loosely based in Hinduisim with large doses of western religion thrown into the mix.

The conceit that the writers created, basing it off these religious philosophies, was that as a group, the Lostaways subconsciously created this "sideways" world where they exist in purgatory until they are "awakened" and find one another. Once they all find one another, they can then move on and move forward. In essence, this is the show's concept of the afterlife. According to the show, everyone creates their own "Sideways" purgatory with their "soulmates" throughout their lives and exist there until they all move on together. That's a beautiful notion. Even if you aren't religious or even spirtual, the idea that we live AND die together is deeply profound and moving.

It's a really cool and spirtual concept that fits the whole tone and subtext the show has had from the beginning. These people were SUPPOSED to be together on that plane. They were supposed to live through these events -- not JUST because of Jacob. But because that's what the universe or God (depending on how religious you wish to get) wanted to happen. The show was always about science vs faith -- and it ultimately came down on the side of faith. It answered THE core question of the series. The one question that has been at the root of every island mystery, every character backstory, every plot twist. That, by itself, is quite an accomplishment.

How much you want to extrapolate from that is up to you as the viewer. Think about season 1 when we first found the Hatch. Everyone thought that's THE answer! Whatever is down there is the answer! Then, as we discovered it was just one station of many. One link in a very long chain that kept revealing more, and more of a larger mosiac.

But the writer's took it even further this season by contrasting this Sideways "purgatory" with the Island itself. Remember when Michael appeared to Hurley, he said he was not allowed to leave the Island. Just like the MIB. He wasn't allowed into this sideways world and thus, was not afforded the opportunity to move on. Why? Because he had proven himself to be unworthy with his actions on the Island. He failed the test. The others, passed. They made it into Sideways world when they died -- some before Jack, some years later. In Hurley's case, maybe centuries later. They exist in this sideways world until they are "awakened" and they can only move on TOGETHER because they are linked. They are destined to be together for eternity. That was their destiny.

They were NOT linked to Anna Lucia, Daniel, Roussou, Alex, Miles, Lupidis, (and all the rest who weren't in the chuch -- basically everyone who wasn't in season 1). Yet those people exist in Sideways world. Why? Well again, here's where they leave it up to you to decide. The way I like to think about it, is that those people who were left behind in Sideways world have to find their own soulmates before they can wake up. It's possible that those links aren't people from the island but from their other life (Anna's parnter, the guy she shot --- Roussou's husband, etc etc).

A lot of people have been talking about Ben and why he didn't go into the Church. And if you think of Sideways world in this way, then it gives you the answer to that very question. Ben can't move on yet because he hasn't connected with the people he needs to. It's going to be his job to awaken Roussou, Alex, Anna Lucia (maybe), Ethan, Goodspeed, his father and the rest. He has to attone for his sins more than he did by being Hurley's number two. He has to do what Hurley and Desmond did for our Lostaways with his own people. He has to help them connect. And he can only move on when all the links in his chain are ready to. Same can be said for Faraday, Charlotte, Whidmore, Hawkins etc. It's really a neat, and cool concept. At least to me.

But, from a more "behind the scenes" note: the reason Ben's not in the church, and the reason no one is in the church but for Season 1 people is because they wrote the ending to the show after writing the pilot. And never changed it. The writers always said (and many didn't believe them) that they knew their ending from the very first episode. I applaud them for that. It's pretty fantastic. Originally Ben was supposed to have a 3 episode arc and be done. But he became a big part of the show. They could have easily changed their ending and put him in the church -- but instead they problem solved it. Gave him a BRILLIANT moment with Locke outside the church ... and then that was it. I loved that. For those that wonder -- the original ending started the moment Jack walked into the church and touches the casket to Jack closing his eyes as the other plane flies away. That was always JJ's ending. And they kept it.

For me the ending of this show means a lot. Not only because I worked on it, but because as a writer it inspired me in a way the medium had never done before. I've been inspired to write by great films. Maybe too many to count. And there have been amazing TV shows that I've loved (X-Files, 24, Sopranos, countless 1/2 hour shows). But none did what LOST did for me. None showed me that you could take huge risks (writing a show about faith for network TV) and stick to your creative guns and STILL please the audience. I learned a lot from the show as a writer. I learned even more from being around the incredible writers, producers, PAs, interns and everyone else who slaved on the show for 6 years.

In the end, for me, LOST was a touchstone show that dealt with faith, the afterlife, and all these big, spirtual questions that most shows don't touch. And to me, they never once waivered from their core story -- even with all the sci-fi elements they mixed in. To walk that long and daunting of a creative tightrope and survive is simply astounding."

Έγραψε...
 

Kosh

Μέλος Σωματείου
7 September 2006
91,638
Εκεί ψηλά.....
Re: Lost - season 6 (final)

Πως δηλ. περιμενετε να εξηγησουν κατι που ακομη και η συγχρονη φυσικη αδυνατει να εξηγησει (αν και υπαρχει η θεωρια που τα προβλεπει - οπως ταξιδια στο χρονο, παραλληλα συμπαντα, θεωρια χορδων κλπ)...



Πολλες σειρες scifi δεν εξηγουν παρα επιφανειακα. Αυτο δεν ειναι απαραιτητα κακο. ΑΠλα το δεχεσαι για να συνεχισει η ιστορια.



Γιαννη δεν περιμεναμε ρε συ τα blue prints της θεωριας του ταξιδιου στον χρονο.

Περιμεναμε να μας πουνε ομως ποιος φουστης εφτιαξε τον τροχο πχ....


1) ο Θεος ?

2) ο J.J.Abraams ?

3) οι Φαραω ?

4) ο Μελ Μπρουκς ?



Καποιος θα τον εβαλε δεν μπορει...:ernaehrung004:


Ασε μην το πιασουμε....απο οπου και να το πιασεις τρυπιο ειναι ....
 
22 June 2006
34,856
NEO HRAKLEIO
Re: Lost - season 6 (final)

Μα αυτο νομιζω απαντηθηκε... στο προτελευταιο επεισοδιο, οταν η μανα ξαναβρηκε τον MIB , αυτος της ειπε οτι ο ιδιος με τη βοηθεια καποιων "εξυπνων" ανθρωπων , φτιαξανε τον τροχο και βρηκανε μια διοδο για ο φως.
Δεν περιμεναμε ακριβεις απαντησεις ρε Ναθ... κανεις δεν τις εδωσε αιωνες τωρα!

Διαβασε σε παρακαλω αυτα που εαβλα παραπανω με προσοχη και θα σου λυθουν αρκετες αποριες... που αφορουν στο συνολο το LOST και οχι τις λεπτομερειες που δεν παιζουν σημαντικο ρολο ετσι κι αλλιως.
 
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greekgreek

Supreme Member
29 June 2008
6,350
Γιαννιτσά
Απάντηση: Lost - season 6 (final)

Δεν μου άρεσε το φινάλε .
Την έβλεπα την σειρά τα τελευταία χρόνια χωρίς να είμαι φαν της, περίμενα κάτι καλύτερο για φινάλε ,κάτι που να μην το περιμένω.